>> WE THE PEOPLE • SYRACUSE HAS CITIZENS DRAW POLITICAL MAPS • SHOW ME THE MONEY • S.U.. AND THE NEW WORLD OF NCAA RECRUITING AND BIDEN, CHINA AND TAIWAN.

STAY TUNED, IVORY TOWER IS NEXT >> WELCOME TO IVORY TOWER.

I'M DAVID CHANATRY FROM UTICA UNIVERSITY.

I'M JOINED TONIGHT BY NINA MOORE FROM COLGATE UNIVERSITY, TY SEIDULE FROM HAMILTON COLLEGE, BEN BAUGHMAN FROM GANNON UNIVERSITY AND RICK FENNER FROM UTICA UNIVERSITY.

OVER THE PAST YEAR WE'VE SEEN LEGISLATURES, COURTS AND EVEN OUTSIDE EXPERTS, AS WE HAD HERE IN NEW YORK, DRAW NEW POLITICAL MAPS.

THE NEW DISTRICTS FOR OUR LOCAL, STATE AND CONGRESSIONAL DISTRICTS.

HOW ABOUT HAVING AVERAGE CITIZENS DO THE JOB?

THAT'S WHAT WAS TRIED HERE IN SYRACUSE, AND THE NEW DISTRICTS HAVE NOW BEEN APPROVED BY THE COMMON COUNCIL.

COULD THIS APPROACH BE A MODEL TO HELP END THE PARTISAN GERRYMANDERING THAT HAS MADE SO MANY DISTRICTS SOLIDLY ONE PARTY OR SOLIDLY THE OTHER?

BEN?

>> I THINK SOME OF IT WAS GOOD.

I LIKED THAT THEY RANDOMLY SELECTED PEOPLE.

I DO LIKE THE OUTCOME OF THE DIVERSE BACKGROUND OF THE PEOPLE THAT WERE PICKED.

BUT THAT'S NOT A GUARANTEE WHEN YOU RANDOMLY ARE PICKING PEOPLE.

SO SOME OF THE CONS I WOULD SAY IS THAT IT SHOULD BE BIPARTISAN.

WE SEE THIS AND WE HEAR THIS AND WE SEE DIFFERENT THINGS STATE BY STATE.

THERE HAVE BEEN ISSUES, OF COURSE, WHICH IS WHY IT ALWAYS COMES UP.

GERRYMANDERING HAS BEEN AROUND FOR A REALLY LONG TIME.

I WOULD LOVE TO SEE IT GO AWAY.

I DON'T SEE IT GOING AWAY AND I DON'T SEE THIS BEING A PERFECT EXAMPLE BUT I DO THINK SOME GOOD THINGS CAME OUT OF IT.

ULTIMATELY IT SHOULD BE EVIDENCE BASED.

DATA DRIVEN PRACTICES SHOULD BE IN PLACE WHERE THEY'RE MAKING IT AS REPRESENTATIVE AS POSSIBLE.

AND I THINK YOU HAVE TO HAVE PEOPLE WHO KNOW WHAT IS GOING ON IN THE ROOM AND... >> SO IF YOU HAVE TO HAVE PEOPLE THAT KNOW WHAT IS GOING ON, NOT TO DIMINISH THE WORK OF THAT PANEL, BUT THAT MAKES IT SEEM LIKE MAYBE YOUR AVERAGE CITIZEN DOESN'T KNOW ENOUGH ABOUT IT TO REALLY BE ABLE TO-- >> ULTIMATELY ONE LAST THING I DO WANT TO SAY ABOUT THAT IS THEY'RE GOING TO HAVE A VIEW.

THEY'RE GOING TO HAVE SOME POLITICAL INTERESTS.

NO MATTER WHO YOU PICK, SO WHY NOT HAVE THAT TRANSPARENCY UP FRONT AND HAVE AN EVEN SPLIT.

>> YEAH, I THINK IN THE ABSTRACT I WOULD AGREE WITH YOU, BEN, THAT THIS IS A GOOD IDEA IN THE SENSE THAT YOU HAVE CHOSEN AVERAGE CITIZENS INSTEAD OF POLITICIANS WHO DO, IN FACT, HAVE A DOG IN THE FIGHT SO TO SPEAK.

THESE CITIZENS DON'T, AND THAT'S PARTLY BY LAW BECAUSE THEY CAN'T HAVE RUN FOR ELECTION TWO YEARS PRIOR OR TWO YEARS AFTER THEIR SERVICE ON THE COMMISSION.

THE OTHER THING THAT I LIKE ABOUT IT IS THAT AS YOU POINTED OUT, THEY'RE RANDOMLY CHOSEN IN THIS WAY.

EIGHT OF THE 15 ARE CHOSEN BY THE CITY AUDITOR.

THE OTHER SEVEN ARE CHOSEN BY THE EIGHT FROM A LIST OF 100.

I DON'T KNOW HOW THEY GET ON THERE.

BUT THE THING THAT GETS TO ME IS THAT THESE ARE ALSO THE WEAKNESSES, IN SO FAR AS YOU ARE SELECTING AVERAGE CITIZENS TO DO A JOB THAT IN 2010, EVEN THE NEW YORK STATE LEGISLATURE COULD NOT DO.

AND INSTEAD HAD TO TURN TO A SPECIAL MASTER.

THIS IS A VERY COMPLEX PROCESS.

AND TO HAVE-- LISTEN, I'M NOT CASTING ASPERSIONS ON THE BACKGROUND OF THESE FOLKS.

I ADMIRE THEM.

BUT WE ARE TALKING ABOUT A THERAPIST, A LANDSCAPE ARCHITECT PERSON TO TWO RETIRED POLICE OFFICERS AND TWO PROFESSORS BOTH RETIRED, ONE OF WHOM IS A MATH PROFESSOR.

I DON'T KNOW THAT THAT POSITIONS THEM TO BE ABLE TO GO THROUGH THE VERY COMPLEX PROCESS OF DEVISING THE MAPS AND THE LAST THING I'LL SAY IS THAT I SEE A PROBLEM HERE.

AND THE PROBLEM THAT I SEE HERE IS THEIR RELIANCE ON CENSUS BUREAU TRACKS INSTEAD OF ELECTION PRECINCTS, WHICH IS WHAT THE 2019 LAW REQUIRED.

CENSUS BUREAU TRACKS ARE DRIVEN BY COMPUTERS.

THEY DO NOT TAKE INTO ACCOUNT THE SORT OF SHARED INTERESTS IN DEMOGRAPHICS OF THE COMMUNITIES AROUND WHICH THESE MAPS ARE BEING DRIVEN.

>> I THINK, NINA, THE ARGUMENT THEY GAVE IS THAT THE CENSUS TRACKS WERE SMALLER AND IN TERMS OF MAKING THE DISTRICTS THE RIGHT SIZE IN TERMS OF EQUAL POPULATION, THAT ACTUALLY MADE THEIR JOB A LITTLE BIT EASIER.

IT DIDN'T MEAN THAT THEY HAD TO IGNORE THE NEIGHBORHOODS.

BUT I AGREE WITH BOTH OF YOU THAT, YOU KNOW, THIS APPEARS TO BE A WAY, AT LEAST, OF GETTING THE POLITICIANS OUT OF THIS.

BUT I'M NOT SURE THAT THE JOB THAT THEY DID WOULD BE ANY BETTER THAN IF IT HAD BEEN A BI... OR NON-PARTISAN GROUP DOING THIS.

THEY DECIDED ON A MAJORITY/MINORITY DISTRICT.

WHAT IF THEY HADN'T.

WHAT IF THE RANDOM SAMPLE-- THE RANDOM GROUP OF EIGHT HAD ALL TURNED OUT TO BE REPUBLICANS RATHER THAN MOSTLY DEMOCRATS?

THE OUTCOME COULD HAVE BEEN VERY, VERY DIFFERENT.

AND LOOKING AT THE MAP THAT THEY DREW UP, IT'S VERY DIFFERENT FROM THE CURRENT ONE.

WHO IS TO SAY THAT IT IS BETTER?

>> TY, I JUST WANT TO-- IS THIS SOMETHING THAT COULD BE APPLIED EVEN IN A LARGER CITY THAN SYRACUSE?

>> I THINK IT COULD.

I THINK SYRACUSE IS THE LABORATORY OF DEMOCRACY.

AGAIN GOING BACK TO THAT PROGRESSIVE ERA OF GIVING CITIZENS THE ABILITY TO SAY THAT THEY WERE TOGETHER FOR 15 MONTHS AND DURING THAT TIME THEY BECAME FRIENDS, THEY KNEW EACH OTHER'S FAMILIES AND THEY TRUSTED ONE ANOTHER.

WHERE ELSE WOULD THAT HAPPEN?

CUED " KUDOS TO SYRACUSE FOR PUTTING IT TOGETHER, SEEING IT THROUGH AND TRYING IT.

DON'T LET PERFECT BE THE ENEMY OF GOOD.

THIS IS NOT A PERFECT PLAN BUT THIS IS A GOOD PLAN.

WHEN HAVE WE EVER HAD A PERFECT PLAN.

>> WE HAVE NEVER HAD IT IN TERMS OF REDISTRICTING AND OFTEN BECAUSE PEOPLE HAD A DOG IN THE FIGHT AS YOU SAID WITH THE POLITICAL... >> IF THIS BECOMES THE NORM, WOULDN'T ALL SPECIAL INTEREST GROUPS PACK THE INITIAL GROUP OF PEOPLE WHO WERE VOLUNTEERING TO DO THIS AND THEN, YOU KNOW, WE WOULD JUST END UP, I THINK, IN THE SAME POSITION THAT WE HAVE BEEN IN THE PAST.

>> THE EVIDENCE, FROM THIS ONE, IT DIDN'T HAPPEN.

MAYBE IN THE FUTURE THERE ARE WAYS OF KEEPING THAT FROM HAPPENING.

BUT FOR THIS ONE, I THINK IT'S A SUCCESS.

SO I WOULD SAY WHY NOT TRY IT OTHER PLACES.

WE KNOW THE OTHER WAY DOESN'T WORK.

WHY NOT TRY MOVE OF THESE?

IT MAY BE ANOTHER WAY TO STOP IT.

BUT THIS ONE, AGAIN, DON'T LET PERFECT BE THE ENEMY OF GOOD.

THIS ONE WORKED.

>> AND WHY NOT HAVE THE COURTS DO IT?

THE LEGISLATURES, EVERYBODY DOES HAVE A DOG IN THE FIGHT AND SO IT'S TURNED OUT TO BE A MESS.

DISTRICTS ARE ALMOST ALL ONE SIDE OR ALL THE OTHER, IT SEEMS LIKE, AS, YOU KNOW, THE DATA HAS FORCED THE DATA IN THE COMPUTER TECHNOLOGY HAS MADE IT EASIER TO DRAW A DISTRICT TO FIT YOUR INTERESTS.

>> TO THAT QUESTION, I WOULD SAY THAT COURTS WILL ULTIMATELY CHIME IN HERE BECAUSE THE DRAWING OF THE MAJORITY/MINORITY DISTRICT WILL BE LITIGATED ON THE BASIS OF IT HAVING BEEN RACE CONSCIOUS AND THE SUPREME COURT HAS STRUCK THAT DOWN.

I DOO THINK AS TY HAS POINTED OUT, THERE IS A VALUE TO GRASSROOTS MOBILIZATION BEING INVOLVED HERE.

WHO BETTER TO DO THAT THAN THE FOLKS WHO LIVE IN THE COMMUNITY AND KNOW WHAT THEIR SHARED INTERESTS ARE.

>> THE LABORATORY OF DEMOCRACY.

WE ARE GOING TO GO WITH THAT PHRASE FOR TODAY FOR SYRACUSE.

NOW, CENTRAL NEW YORKERS LOVE THEIR S.U.

SPORTS TEAM AND WE LOVE IT WHEN THEY WIN.

NOW THE UNIVERSITY'S MOST PROMINENT ATHLETIC BOOSTER WANTS TO MAKE SURE THEY'RE COMPETITIVE.

ADAM WEITSMAN SAYS HE'LL OFFER ONE MILLION DOLLARS EACH TO A TOP FOOTBALL AND TOP BASKETBALL RECRUIT.

WEITSMAN SAYS THE ATHLETES WILL REPRESENT HIS COMPANY.

THAT'S SOMETHING THEY'RE ALLOWED TO DO NOW THAT COLLEGE ATHLETES CAN PROFIT FROM USE OF THEIR NAME, IMAGE AND LIKENESS.

BOOSTERS AT OTHER SCHOOLS HAVE SET UP SIMILAR SCHEMES.

THIS IS A LONG WAY FROM BUYING A BUDDY BUCKETS T-SHIRT.

SHOULD THE UNIVERSITY GO ALONG?

>> WELL, THE FIRST THING I THOUGHT OF, BOY, AM I GLAD I'M ON HAMILTON COLLEGE, DIVISION 3, GO CONTINENTALS, BEAT THE MAMMOTHS.

THAT'S OUR GAME THIS WEEKEND.

BUT SHOULD THEY DO IT?

THEY'RE A POWER 5 CONSCIENCE.

IF THEY WANT TO COMPETE, THEY SHOULD.

THIS N.D I.L.

IS NOW IT'S LEGAL.

YEAH, IT'S GREAT.

I'M ALL FOR IT BECAUSE IT WAS A 20 BALANCED INDUSTRY IS WHAT COLLEGE SPORTS IS.

AND PLAYERS GET ALMOST NOTHING.

THE ONLY PROBLEM WITH N.I.L.

AND THE ONLY PROBLEM WITH THIS FOR SYRACUSE IS THAT PLAYERS DON'T GET ENOUGH.

I HOPE THE PLAYERS UNIONIZE AND GET A MUCH BIGGER CUT OF THE REVENUE AND DOESN'T JUST GO TO BUILDING FACILITIES AND COACHES POCKETS.

>> THEY'RE NOT GETTING A CUT OF THE REVENUE.

WHAT IS IRONIC HERE IS THAT THE REVENUE STREAM FROM THE TELEVISION CONTRACTS ARE STILL GOING TO THE COLLEGES.

THE COLLEGES AREN'T PROVIDING ANY OF THIS MONEY.

IT'S ALL COMING FROM OUTSIDE ALUMNI AND BUSINESS PERSONS THROUGH THESE COLLECTIVES.

SO I THOUGHT IT WAS IRONIC THAT, AS YOU SAID, THE FOCUS OF THIS AND WHAT CAUSED THE PROBLEM IN THE FIRST PLACE WAS THE FACT THAT STUDENTS FELT THEY WERE BEING UNDERCOMPENSATED AND HERE THEY STILL ARE BEING UNDERCOMPENSATED BY THE COLLEGES.

>> WELL, I THINK SOME OF IT DEPENDS UPON HOW PLAYERS GO ABOUT GETTING THESE DEALS.

BECAUSE THERE IS ONE YOUNG MAN WHO IS AT NORFOLK STATE UNIVERSITY, WHO IS KNOWN AS THE KING OF NIL.

HE HAS RACKED UP 70 DIFFERENT ENDORSEMENTS AND HE IS WORKING WITH OTHER PLAYERS TO BE ABLE TO DO THAT.

SO THIS IS REALLY LESS INSTITUTIONALLY DRIVEN THAN PLAYER INITIATED AND ITSELF SOCIAL MEDIA PLATFORMS WHERE THEY DO MOST OF THE COURTING POTENTIAL ENDORSERS.

>> SO I SUSPECT IN MANY CASES IT'S SMALLER SCALE AND PEOPLE ARE USING SOCIAL MEDIA AND THEY'RE GETTING SMALLER DEALS.

IN THIS CASE WE ARE TALKING ABOUT BIG MONEY.

AND IT'S NOT JUST HERE.

MANY SCHOOLS ARE DOING THIS OR BOOSTERS AT MANY SCHOOLS ARE DOING THIS.

WHY IS THIS NOT PAY FOR PLAY?

>> IT IS.

I MEAN IT ULTIMATELY IS.

>> NOT ACCORDING TO THE NCAA.

>> NOT ACCORDING TO NCAA.

AND NOR IS IT-- IT'S BEING TALKED ABOUT MORE.

IT'S NOT SUSTAINABLE.

WHAT IS HAPPENING RIGHT NOW.

IT'S LIKE THE WILD WEST.

THEY SUPPOSEDLY CAN'T TIE IT TO PERFORMANCE.

THEY SUPPOSEDLY CAN'T TIE IT TO THE SCHOOL THEY'RE ATTENDING.

SO THEORETICALLY THE PLAYER CAN GET PAID $5 MILLION BY SOMEBODY BECAUSE THEY'RE COMING OUT OF HIGH SCHOOL AND THEY'RE BELIEVED TO BE A FIVE STAR AND WE HAVE SEEN THIS ANECDOTALLY, WHERE THEY GET A BUNCH OF MONEY AND THEY GET HURT AND THE MONEY HAS BEEN GIVEN.

THEY CAN THEN TRANSFER AND PLAY SOMEWHERE ELSE.

SO YOU KNOW, IT'S JUST BEING TALKED ABOUT NOW AND IT IS ONE OF THOSE THINGS THAT IT IS THE WILD WEST.

THERE AREN'T THE GUARD RAILS IN PLACE THAT THERE WERE.

>> BECAUSE THE GUARD RAILS BEFORE WAS THE NCAA, WHICH IS A TERRIBLE ORGANIZATION THAT EXPLOITS, PARTICULARLY BLACK MEN, FOR THEIR OWN GAIN.

SO THE FACT THAT NOW WE ARE CHANGING THE POWER STRUCTURE AND IT'S NOT WHITE COACHES, IT'S NOT THE SCHOOLS THAT ARE GETTING ALL THESE, I THINK, IS FANTASTIC.

IT JUST NEEDS TO GET BIGGER AND THE PLAYERS NEED A BIGGER SHARE OF THE $20 BILLION.

>> AND ACCORDING TO THE DATA THAT WE HAVE SO FAR, IN JUST THE FIRST YEAR, PLAYERS RACKED UP A BILLION DOLLARS.

SO TO YOUR QUESTION, IS THIS PAY TO PLAY?

I BELIEVE THIS IS ALREADY PLAYING AND NOW YOU ARE GOING TO GET PAID.

>> IT CLEARLY... >> WHICH IS WHAT WE SHOULD DO.

>> RIGHT.

>> CLEARLY THE RULES THAT THE NCAA HAVE ARE VERY VAGUE AND THERE IS NO ENFORCEMENT MECHANISM ANYMORE.

INTERESTINGLY ENOUGH THOUGH, THERE ARE BIG QUESTIONS.

FOR INSTANCE, IF A COLLEGE IS A NIKE SCHOOL, CAN THEY PREVENT STUDENTS FROM SIGNING ON WITH ADIDDA.

IF A SCHOOL IS PEPSI.

CAN AN ATHLETE COME INTO PRACTICE WITH A CAN OF COKE IN THEIR HAND?

WE ARE GETTING MORE MONEY TO THE ATHLETES, AND IT'S BECOMING, YOU KNOW, A DE FACTO MINOR LEAGUE SPORTS INDUSTRY BUT I THINK THERE ARE A NUMBER OF ISSUES THAT STILL NEED TO BE IRONED OUT.

>> WE KNOW THEY CAN'T COME IN WITH A LINE OF COKE BUT... [LAUGHTER] >> I DON'T THINK IT SHOULD BE PAY TO PLAY.

I THINK IT SHOULD BE STUDENTS FIRST.

BUT THE REALITY IS THAT IT'S BEEN THERE AND THIS IS NOT SUSTAINABLE THAT'S IN PLACE.

IT'S GOING TO RUN ITS COURSE AND IT'S GOING TO GET CLOSE TOTER WAY IT WAS.

>> I WONDER HOW CAN THE SYSTEM, AS IT IS, WITH NIL, HOW CAN THAT BE MAYBE AMENDED TO PERHAPS MAKE IT MORE FAIR.

>> REMEMBER THE STUDENT ATHLETE, THE TERM STUDENT ATHLETE CAME IN THE 1960s WHEN THERE WAS A PARALYZED FOOTBALL PLAYER WHO SUED FOR COMPENSATION AND THE NCAA SAID THAT NO, YOU ARE NOT A WORKER EVEN THOUGH YOU ARE WORKING MORE THAN 40 HOURS A WEEK AND YOU ARE GETTING PAID IN KIND BECAUSE YOU ARE A STUDENT FIRST.

SO THAT STUDENT ATHLETE, JUST THAT TERM, IS ONE THAT HAS BEEN USED TO HURT PLAYERS FOREVER.

>> AND INACCURATELY BECAUSE THEY'RE NOT STUDENTS FIRST.

MANY OF THESE ATHLETES, THEY DON'T GET TO PARTICIPATE IN STUDY ABROAD PROGRAMS.

I'VE GOT STUDENTS SOMETIMES WHO CAN'T COME TO A LATE EVENT THAT I MIGHT SCHEDULE AND THEY SPEND THEIR HOLIDAYS ON CAMPUS AND THEY'RE DOING 40 HOURS WORTH OF WORK EVEN THOUGH IT'S BEYOND WHAT THE NCAA ALLOWS.

SO NO, I THINK THAT'S A MISNOMER TO SAY THEY'RE STUDENT ATHLETES.

I'D SAY THEY'RE ATHLETIC STUDENTS.

>> IT'S A BUSINESS AND WHERE ELSE IN AMERICA CAN YOU GET AWAY WITH NOT PAYING YOUR EMPLOYEES?

>> BINGO.

>> BUT THE PROBLEM IS, THEY'RE NOT ALL GETTING PAID.

IT'S THE STAR PLAYERS THAT ARE GETTING PAID THE MONEY.

WHAT SHOULD BE SUPPORTED IS THE TEAM.

YES, I THINK OUR ATHLETES NEED SUPPORT.

THEY NEED THE EQUIPMENT.

THEY NEED TO BE ABLE TO NOT HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT EXTRA JOBS AND SO FORTH TO GET THEM THROUGH SCHOOL.

>> OKAY.

NOW PRESIDENT BIDEN SAID ON 60 MINUTES THIS WEEK THAT U.S.

FORCES WOULD DEFEND TAIWAN IF IT WAS ATTACKED BY CHINA.

HE'S SAID SIMILAR THINGS PREVIOUSLY, IF NOT AS UNEQUIVOCALLY, AS HE DID THIS TIME.

HIS STAFF INSISTS THE U.S. POLICY OF STRATEGIC AMBIGUITY HAS NOT CHANGED IF OUR POLICY IS TO DETER CHINA FROM AN INVASION, DOES THE POLICY NEED CLARITY?

OR DID BIDEN ERR BY BEING SO DEFNINITIVE?

>> I DON'T THINK HE STATED IT PLAINLY BECAUSE HE COOPERATE.

THERE IS A SCRIPTURE THAT I'M REMINDED OF THAT SAYS A DOUBLE MINDED MAN IS UNSTABLE IN ALL OF HIS WAYS.

IN THIS CASE WE HAVE A DOUBLE MINDED POLICY AND HENCE WE ARE ALWAYS GOING TO HAVE POLICY MAKERS WHO APPEAR TO BE TALKING OUT OF BOTH SIDES OF THEIR MOUTH.

JUST CONSIDER-- AND THIS IS SOMETHING I LOOKED AT TO TRY TO UNDERSTAND EXACTLY WHY DOES THIS SEEM TO BE SO MUSHY?

THE STATE DEPARTMENT MAKES CLEAR THAT-- CHECK THIS OUT-- THAT THE U.S.

ACKNOWLEDGES TAIWAN AS A COUNTRY BUT DOESN'T RECOGNIZE IT AS A COUNTRY.

THAT IT ACKNOWLEDGES CHINA'S CLAIM TO TAIWAN BUT DOESN'T RECOGNIZE THAT CLAIM TO TAIWAN; THAT IT IS INVOLVED NOT IN DIPLOMATIC RELATIONS WITH TAIWAN, BUT A ROBUST UNOFFICIAL RELATIONSHIP, WHICH TO ME SOUNDS LIKE REALLY, REALLY INTENSE SHACKING UP, SO TO SPEAK.

SO-- AND IT ALSO ARGUES THAT THERE IS NO TAIWAN INDEPENDENCE, BUT THAT IF ANYONE TRIES TO MAKE A MOVE ON TAIWAN, THEN THE U.S. WILL ENGAGE MILITARY RESOURCES TO SUPPORT IT.

>> SO THAT SORT OF DIPLOMATIC, YOU KNOW, THAT'S THE A CLASS IN DIPLOMACY SPEAK, RIGHT?

IT'S KIND OF WORKED, HABIT IT, HASN'T IT, FOR 40 YEARS.

>> THE TAIWAN RELATION RELATIONS ACT CAME IN.

THINGS ARE SO DIFFERENT RIGHT NOW.

CHINA HAS HEDGE MONIC DESIGNS ON THE ENTIRE REGION, THREATENING JAPAN AND THE PHILIPPINES, OUR ALLIES.

THEY HAVE SPENT 20 YEARS UPDATING THEIR MILITARY AND REMEMBER TAIWAN IS DIFFERENT, TOO.

1: THEY'RE A DEMOCRACY.

THEY'RE THE EIGHTH ECONOMY IN THE WORLD.

IMAGINE IF CHINA GOT AHOLD OF THE SEMICONDUCTOR INDUSTRY.

IN A WAY, THAT'S MORE IMPORTANT TO US THAN OIL.

WE CAN DO OUR OWN OIL.

SEMICONDUCTORS ARE IN TAIWAN.

THE IDEA OF HAVING IT A LITTLE BIT MORE TOWARD TAIWAN WHICH IS WHAT BIDEN IS DOING, I THINK IS THE RIGHT THING.

>> BEN?

>> ULTIMATELY CHINA IS A THREAT TO US FROM AN ECONOMICAL STANDPOINT TO A MILITARY STANDPOINT AND TAIWAN WE HAVE SUPPORTED THROUGHOUT THE YEARS FOR THE REASONS THAT HAVE BEEN STATED.

BUT ULTIMATELY, WHAT THIS REALLY DOES COME DOWN TO IS PROTECTING DEMOCRACY AND THAT'S WHAT WE ARE TRYING TO DO, IN ADDITION TO THE STRATEGIC LOCATION OF WHERE TAIWAN IS AND WHAT THEY REPRESENT.

>> I THINK, YOU KNOW, THE ISSUE REALLY COMES DOWN TO WHETHER WE ARE BEST SERVED BY HAVING A MORE OR LESS AMBIGUOUS STANCE.

AND, YOU KNOW, I CAN SEE ARGUMENTS ON BOTH SIDES.

WHAT BOTHERS ME A LITTLE BIT IS THAT AT TIMES IT LOOKS LIKE WE HAVE AN UNINTENTIONAL POLICY WITH ROGUES LIKE NANCY PELOSI GOING OUT OVER ON HER OWN AND NOW PERHAPS BIDEN TALKING OFF THE CUFF ABOUT WHETHER OR NOT, YOU KNOW, HOW DIRECTLY WE WOULD BE INVOLVED THERE.

I THINK IT'S IMPORTANT THAT WHATEVER DIRECTION WE GO, THAT IT BE INTENTIONAL, IT BE BASED UPON THE BEST AVAILABLE INFORMATION AND NOT INDIVIDUALS SORT OF DOING THINGS ON THEIR OWN.

>> IT IS DESIGNED TO BE AMBIGUOUS.

>> BUT TO TY'S POINT ABOUT THINGS CHANGING IN THE INDO-PACIFIC, THERE HAS TO BE A RESPONSIVENESS.

WE CAN'T STICK WITH WHAT WAS STIPULATED IN 1979 IF THE WORLD AND CHINA'S DESIGNS ARE VERY DIFFERENT, WHICH THEY ARE.

>> AND I THINK THAT'S WHY BIDEN HAS SAID THIS THREE TIMES NOW.

THEY'RE SAYING IT PURPOSE AND THEY'RE WALKING IT BACK ON PURPOSE AND PELOSI IS ONE OF DOZENS OF SENATORS AND CONGRESSMEN WHO HAVE BEEN TO TAIWAN.

SO I THINK WE ARE SAYING THAT THIS IS MORE IMPORTANT-- BECAUSE IT'S FAR GREATER STRATEGIC IMPORTANCE.

AND REMEMBER, ALL THOSE SEMICONDUCTOR FACT RIS ARE ON THE WEST SIDE SO CLOSER TO-- THEY'RE CLOSER TO CHINA.

SO IT'S A BIG DEAL TO TRY TO FIGURE THIS OUT AND MAKE SURE IT DOES NOT BECOME ANOTHER UKRAINE.

>> SO YOU JUST SAID THAT BIDEN MIGHT BE SAYING THESE THINGS IN PURPOSE AND THE STAFF IS WALKING IT BACK ON PURPOSE.

SO IS THAT ALL PART OF A SPECIFIC STRATEGY THEN TO KEEP IT MUDDLED IN A SENSE?

>> TOTALLY.

SORT OF A-- TO SAY THE PRESIDENT IS SAYING, YOU BETTER LISTEN TO THE PRESIDENT.

THE STAFF IS SAYING THIS.

WE ARE CONFUSED BUT WE WANT TO LISTEN TO THE PRESIDENT BECAUSE HE SAID IT THREE TIMES NOW.

YEAH, IT'S MEANT TO BE AMBIGUOUS BUT NOT THAT AMBIGUOUS AS IT USED TO BE.

>> I'M GOING TO DISAGREE WITH YOU A LITTLE BIT.

I THINK BIDEN IS SPEAKING FROM HIS GUT FROM WHEN HE BEGAN IN THE SENATE AND HE KNOWS IN REALITY THAT WE ARE GOING TO BE MORE AGGRESSIVE.

BUT ON PAPER WE ARE SAYING NO, WE REALLY DON'T RECOGNIZE-- THAT'S A GENEROUS READING.

>> I HOPE TY IS RIGHT BECAUSE IF IT'S LIKE YOU SAID, TY, THEN THAT'S AN INTENTIONAL POLICY.

IF IT'S TALKING FROM HIS GUT, I'M REALLY CONCERNED ABOUT, YOU KNOW, COMMITTING U.S. TO A POLICY BASED UPON HIS OFF THE CUFF STATEMENT.

>> IT IS AN INTENTIONAL POLICY, BUT I DO THINK THAT BIDEN IS SPEAKING WHAT HE FEELS.

THAT'S WHAT I THINK.

>> SO WOULD AMERICANS SUPPORT A WAR IN THE PACIFIC.

>> AGAINST CHINA I THINK YOU WOULD SAY A LITTLE BIT MORE BIPARTISAN CONSENSUS AROUND THAT.

I DON'T KNOW THAT IT WOULD BE SO MUCH ABOUT TAIWAN BUT ABOUT CHINA'S AGGRESSION.

>> NOW HAVE I TO GO TO OUR As AND Fs.

NINA, CAN WE HAVE YOUR F?

>> OF COURSE YOU CAN.

THE UNIVERSAL FREE MEALS PROGRAM AT PUBLIC SCHOOLS WILL END SOON NOW THAT FEDERAL FUNDING FOR THE PROGRAM HAS BEEN REMOVED, IN ESSENCE.

THE ACT THAT PROVIDED FOR IT WAS PASSED LAST YEAR TO ENSURE FREE LUNCH TO ALL KIDS REGARDLESS OF INCOME.

BUT WITH THE END OF PANDEMIC FUNDING, MORE FOR STOOD INSECURITY HAS RISEN AND UNFORTUNATELY THIS REMOVAL OF FREE MEALS WILL BE VERY HARMFUL TO LOTS OF FAMILIES.

>> TY, YOUR F. >> TO GOVERNOR RON DeSANTIS FOR TRICKING VENEZUELANS WHO WERE HERE LEGALLY SENDING THEM TO MANUFACTURE WITHOUT TELLING ANYONE.

HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH FLORIDA AND YET HE SENT THEM THERE.

IT'S A CRUEL TRICK THAT HE PLAYED ON THEM AND REMINDS ME OF WHAT SOUTHERN SEGREGATIONISTS DID IN THE 70s TRICKING BLACK FAMILIES TO GO NORTH AS WELL.

>> BEN, YOUR F. >> MY F GOES TO THE MORALITY POLICE IN EYE RAN WHICH LED TO THE DEATH OF A YOUNG LADY 22 YEARS OLD AND HAS SPARKED RIOTS IN THE REGION.

BBC REPORTED THIS MORNING THAT AT LEAST 18 DEATHS HAVE BEEN VERIFIED DUE TO THIS.

>> AND RICK, YOUR F. >> TO VIRGINIA GOVERNOR GLEN YOUNGTON PROPOSING LIMITING ACCOMMODATIONS FOR TRANS GENDER STUDENTS.

THE PROPOSAL STATES THAT PERSONNEL, SCHOOL PERSONNEL SHALL REFER TO EACH STUDENT USING ONLY THE PRONOUNS APPROPRIATE TO THEIR BIOLOGICAL SEX UNLESS REQUESTED IN WRITING BY A PARENT.

BUT EVEN IF PARENTS MAKE THE REQUEST, SCHOOL PERSONNEL WOULD NOT BE COMPELLED TO ADDRESS OR REFER TO STUDENTS IN ANY MANOR IF THAT PERSONNEL MEMBER THOUGHT IT VIOLATED THEIR CONSTITUTIONALLY PROTECTED RIGHTS.

>> NOW OUR AS.

>> AN OHIO GRANDMOTHER WENT TO THE GOODWILL TO BUY A NEW KARAOKE MACHINE AFTER WEARING THEM OUT GOING TO NURSING HOMES AND THE REST IS HISTORY.

♪ HE'S GOT THE WHOLE WORLD IN HIS HANDS ♪ >> OKAY.

LET'S GO TO TY FOR YOUR A.

>> TO NEW YORK A.G. LETITIA JAMES.

NOT ONLY DID SHE SAY SUE TRUMP SHE SAID HIS ANTICIPATE IS 11,000 SQUARE FEET AND GAVE THE BEST LINE OF THE WEEK.

FOR DONALD TRUMP, IT'S NOT THE ART OF THE DEAL.

IT'S THE ART OF THE STEAL.

>> MY A GOES TO BECKY HOLMES WHO HAS BEEN RAISING THE AWARENESS OF CATFISHING SCAMS.

SHE WAS REACHED OUT TO LIKE SHE HAS BEEN LOTS OF TIMES, WHERE IT STARTED OUT WHERE HE WAS TALKING NICE TO HER AND ASKING ABOUT HER WEEKEND.

THEN NEEDED $3200, WHICH THEN LED TO HER SAYING SHE WAS GETTING ON A BOAT TO COME TO HIM TO GIVE HIM THE MONEY.

HE SAID YOU CAN'T GET TO IT BY HELICOPTER SO SHE SHOWED HIM A PICTURE AND SAID SHE WAS COMING BY HELICOPTER.

>> AND RICK, YOUR A, PLEASE.

>> MY A GOES TO AARON JUDGE.

HE HIT HIS 60th HOME RUN TYING BABE RUTH'S MARK LANDING HIM ONE BEHIND ROG ARE MARIS' 61 IN THE AMERICAN LEAGUE.

IF HE GETS TO 62, THE ONLY PLAYERS WITH MORE HOME RUNS IN ONE SEASON WOULD BE BOBBY BONDS, MARK MAGUIRE AND SAMMY SOSA ALL BELIEVED TO HAVE USED PERFORMANCE ENHANCING DRUGS.

>> THAT'S A GREAT A WE ARE TALKING SPORTS ON THE SHOW BECAUSE THE NIL, BUT AARON JUDGE WITH THOSE RECORDS AND, YES, I THINK IT SHOULD BE REFERRED TO, NOW I'M OPINING HERE.

IT SHOULD BE REFERRED TO IN THE ARTICLES AS THE RECORD.

I READ A PIECE ON ESPN THAT NEVER MENTIONED THOSE THREE PLAYERS YOU MENTIONED, BONDS, SOSA AND MAGUIRE ALL HAD A LITTLE HELP IN HITTING ALL THOSE HOME RUNS.

>> JUDGE IS ALSO IN THE RUNNING FOR THE TRIPLE CROWN.

>> ANOTHER ASTONISHING FACT.

THANK YOU FOR JOINING US THIS EVENINGMENT FOR COMMENTS YOU CAN WRITE TO THE ADDRESS ON YOUR SCREEN.

IF YOU WOULD LIKE TO VIEW THE SHOW AGAIN YOU CAN VIEW IT ONLINE AT WCNY.ORG.

I'M DAVID CHANATRY, FOR ALL OF US AT IVORY TOWER, HAVE A GOOD NIGHT